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AMSHINOV- no quarter asked,no quarter given

Think of me as perpetual Shil'shel Peh

Monday, October 10, 2005

ASPCA Amshinov Office



There are people against Shluging Kaporos with a chicken. And I have always felt that the theory to abort this tradition due to its pagan nature is rubbish.
Plenty of our habits, laws and traditions mimic paganism and are not under fire.
And so for years I followed my ancestors in this high holy days’ ceremony.
Until this year . . .
Because some "entrepreneur" left 200 chickens caged over Shabus, with no food or water on Nostrand avenue in Brooklyn. By Shabus morning most of them were dead.
One ecscaped and got caught in a sewer drain.
I’m no tree hugger but
TZAR BAH’LAY CHAIM is no small sin.
The Ari (a proponent of Shluging with chickens) never killed a fly, he allowed rodents to run free in his home, he would not rip a leaf off a tree.
You want pagan rituals , suffering animals is pagan.

-amshinover:if you have nothing nice to say, say it here


  • At 10/10/2005 9:28 AM, Blogger RuchniGashmi said…

    Because someone killed some chickens you're going to forsake your minhag? I am not for Tzarbeh Lchayim, I think it's horrible that someone did this, what has this got to do with you. If you have a problem, find out who the entrepeneur is and sned him a dead chicken or something, why take out your anger on the minhag? I am not getting this amshi. Oh and please comment on my recent post please!

  • At 10/10/2005 12:23 PM, Blogger PsychoToddler said…

    I'm with you, Amshi. For once.

  • At 10/10/2005 12:27 PM, Blogger Still Wonderin' said…

    "why take out your anger on the minhag?"

    Oh, the poor minhag hurt it's feelings. Say sorry. Make nice. and while you're at it, just make sure you STOMP on those live chickens and make normal religious Jews look like a bunch of barbaric FREAKS in the process.

  • At 10/10/2005 12:45 PM, Anonymous stranger from a strange land said…

    maybe you can clear this up - why is it called "Shloggen" Kappores in the first place?

  • At 10/10/2005 12:53 PM, Blogger Still Wonderin' said…

    Because you've got to be out of your shloggen mind to think it's OK to import crates of livestock to urban street corners, creating traffic congestion, hideous odors, a health hazard with all the chicken shit everywhere, and to boot, a ridiculous spectacle that debases religious Jews while clearly causing pain and suffering to the chickens.

  • At 10/10/2005 1:28 PM, Blogger Mar Gavriel said…


    (Minhagh Frankfurt-am-Main is to not do kapporôs anyway, so we don't have that problem.)

  • At 10/10/2005 5:04 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said…

    We use money when doing kaporos.

  • At 10/10/2005 6:36 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said…

    I haven't heard about that Nostrand Ave atrocity anywhere else. Can you provide a link? thanks, Yanky

  • At 10/10/2005 9:09 PM, Anonymous MM said…

    Great to see that you are going lishitoscho. Are you going to leave shul for musaf and for korbonos ( on Yom Kippur and succos I mean) another Pagan Ritual. (as I am sure you are aware)
    or will you follow through entirely, kidevrey rav Kook bizman moshiach that the korbonis will be vegetables? If that is the case just do kapporos with a carrot and get over with it. Gizeyrah hi milfanay. (MM)

  • At 10/11/2005 5:42 AM, Blogger Steg (dos iz nit der šteg) said…

    There is an accepted variant of kapeires involving money instead of chickens &mdash and it's the only one I've ever done.

    Replace the nefesh tahhat nefesh with a little tzedaqa tatzil mimavet (mavet for both you and the chicken).

  • At 10/11/2005 5:49 AM, Blogger Steg (dos iz nit der šteg) said…

    Did i just assume that kaparot is actually a singular kaporet? Hm.

  • At 10/11/2005 7:24 AM, Blogger Yaakov Aizel said…

    Gee! Black Hatters in Brooklyn disobeying the law. Tell me something I haven't heard yet.

  • At 10/11/2005 8:07 AM, Blogger AMSHINOVER said…

    you missed the point i'm not doing the kaparos with chickens because of tzar balah chaim, and not the pagan reason, i said i do not buy the pagan reason.

  • At 10/11/2005 8:53 AM, Anonymous Anonymous said…

    Gee, nobody knows why we call it "shloggen?"
    I always thought it was because of the abuse those birds take.

  • At 10/11/2005 11:34 AM, Anonymous MM said…

    Rav Kooks objection to using "animals" for Karbonis replacing them with "vegetables" was also due to "Tzar Beh Lichayim".

    The fact that Karbonos "sacrificing to the gods"(regardless if they are animals or veggies) was a pagan custom ( kimivuar Bmoirah) didn't concern him either.

    It was the barbaric nature of the sacrifice, and the cruelty to animals during the pagan ritual that concerned him. True "Tzar beh lichayim"

    Keep that in "mind" as you do the musafim, in the "vishum naavodcho biyirah, vichulu" (MM)

  • At 10/11/2005 8:41 PM, Blogger Steg (dos iz nit der šteg) said…

    big holy barbeque... mmmm....


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